Comments: The Guerena Case, Analysis 5

A video of a bear falling from a tree onto a trampoline, a dog driving a car and a goat that can 'talk' all go viral and thousands post cute little comments on the web about them.

A combat Marine is killed by an out of control SWAT Team, with no reason to even BE at his home, and there is silence.

Where is the outrage? Where are those people who sport the yellow ribbons on their cars that say "Support Our Troops"?

Jose's death is an indication of a far deeper problem for all Americans. It is the acceptance, without question, the death of an innocent fellow human being. The price for this lack of caring is a far greater danger to our republic than a bad economy or unemployment. The good economy will slowly return. Who will return Jose to his family?

Posted by carol at September 28, 2011 01:22 PM

yes it could take thousands of hours before we are ready, maybe be even hundreds of thousands of hours... just put it out of your pretty little head... I sheriff dumbprick will get back to you when the time is ready to strike!

Posted by rumcrook at September 28, 2011 05:45 PM

Mike, in light of Carol's comment above, are you the only one following this story in depth? Absolutely amazing. The time has come from this and my own experiences with police officers, if I were to observe an officer in trouble I will probably turn around and walk the other way. Too difficult to determine who are the bad guys nowadaze.

Posted by Col Bat Guano at September 29, 2011 09:15 AM

@ Col - Sorry to answer for Mike, but yes, Mike is the only one following this story. There were a few articles in the national/local news, however, they emphasized the 'bad guy theme' that the PCSD was putting out and quickly went off the radar. The public seems only to be able to read headlines and the PCSD knows this. Thus, the Sheriff threw out lots of 'mud' against Jose and knew that it would stick because no one reads anything in least not the general public. Now, the PCSD is just waiting for a settlement to be made with Venessa (Jose's wife) and the Sheriff's Dept. knows that will end the publicity.
A combat Marine was allowed to bleed out after being shot 22 times by a totally incompetent SWAT team, and no one noticed. He was left on the battlefield by his brothers. We should all be ashamed.

Posted by carol at September 29, 2011 10:51 AM


Add to that silence that the State & Federal authorities refused to investigate. Back in the day, Detectives called those things clues.

Posted by Buck Turgidson at September 29, 2011 11:19 AM

You seem to be forgetting the little wifey claimed to the press that she saw the men approaching her house and told her husband it was a home invasion.

The video shows that the police were wearing standard OD uniforms with "Police" embazoned on their raid vests.

The police sounded a siren and activated their flashing lights before they knocked and announced.

Therefore it is clear that little wifey is either lying or set up her husband.

If she had truely looked outside, especailly since she was, as she stated, up and awake, then she would have seen, and heard, it was the police.

What more likely happened is that little wifey warned her husband that 5-0 was here and he decided, unwisely, to fight.

Your theory of rogue cops does not fit with the statements from little wifey. They just don't mesh.

Your theories just don't work with the facts.

In fact, his decision to fight the cops probably meant that he had mens reas, guilty intent, or, more likely, a guilty conscience, perhaps about drug dealing or murders. An innocent man does not shoot it out with the cops.

So, little wifey either lied to hubby in order to get him killed, or did not, and he decided to fight the cops. Or she is just lying about the excuse. Which causes more questions, such as why lie to the press about seeing a gang of home invaders? What is she hiding?

Posted by Federale at September 29, 2011 04:07 PM

Anyone who would use the words, "little wifey" deserves no response. Just sad.

Posted by carol at September 29, 2011 04:34 PM


What's sad is your 'reason' for not responding to Federale. That's no better that the "silence" ones.

Seriously, has anyone on this board with 'special knowledge' contacted any of the several investigative government entities that could oversee Dupnik and his Office? Anyone??

Posted by Buck Turgidson at September 29, 2011 06:55 PM

Buck, Sorry, but the whole thing was way too offensive to dignify a response. I am glad, however, to answer your question.
Once the ruling was made by the Pima Cty Attorney there was no where to go. She is basically the person that is over Dupnik. Of course there can be many civil suits filed by the family, and they will probably do so. But those will not really touch the core of the problem. The only way in which Dupnik and others can be held accountable would be at the federal level. It would not surprise me to learn that the family files a case that Jose's civil rights were violated. That would bring in the federal government to review the findings, including those of the County Attorney. That said, politics could play a big part in that situation.
It is all very difficult, but I suspect that only a very bright spotlight of public opinion and outcry will bring real justice to this case.

Posted by carol at September 30, 2011 12:23 AM

I presented facts and Carol was unable to respond. Please, Carol, if that is your real name, explain Mrs. Guerena's statements to the press. If she saw the police approaching, please explain how she mistook police in standard uniform and "Police" emblazoned on their chests, for "home invaders?"

Why, when she was up and awake, tell her husband there were home invaders? Did she not hear the sirens and see the flashing lights? Did she not hear the police pound on the door and announce "Police, Search warrant?"

You and Mike just can't deal with facts. Either here or with Eric "the drug fiend" Scott.

Posted by Federale at September 30, 2011 11:07 PM

Dear Federale:

I suggest you read Update 5.2. As always, I'll leave it to our wise readers to decide who is best able to read and understand the facts, who is factually challenged, and whose inferences drawn from the facts make sense.

Posted by Mike Mc at October 1, 2011 10:31 AM

I ditto Mike.
The end:-)

Posted by carol at October 1, 2011 04:16 PM

A worthy comeback carol!

Explains much......

Posted by Buck Turgidson at October 2, 2011 02:25 PM

Thank you, Buck.

Posted by carol at October 3, 2011 12:24 AM

I did and still no response to Vanessa Guerena's strange and obviously fictional statement to the press.

I note that Carol won't address facts, but only my use of "little wifey."

Facts are hard things and I understand why the important facts are being ignored.

Oh, and Carol, the US Department of Justice Civil Rights Division, nor the local US Attorney's Office, don't make their decisions based on whether or not a person files a civil claim. They make their decisions independant of any civil claim. Nor do they come in and supervise or review the decision of the Pinal County Attorney's Office.

Posted by Federale at October 3, 2011 11:32 AM