Comments: "Nigger"

That's the problem with being PC - words become proxies for politics.

In Australia the word "wog" used to be a derogatory term for immigrants from the Mediterrean countries. The second generation, Aussie-born, appropriated the word for themselves. "Wogs out of Work" was a huge hit as a comedy show and play. There's even now a mini-industry of these comedians based around "Wog". So now the word has lost it's negative meaning for the most part.

Posted by Simon at December 2, 2003 12:03 AM

Hey, this was on tom's nap room a week or so ago, and i just remembered to check it, so i figured i'd reply here and you'd have a better chance of seeing it.

You said:
"So if it's fake why do you act like it's real?"
It's called "satire," Brian. Do you believe that SNL's Weekend Update is real? They sure act like it's real so it must be, right?
"To get other people to believe it's real and put false, negative thoughts about Dean in people's heads? Yeah, that's called propoganda."
Calling a Socialist a Socialist is telling the truth. Comparing Dean to the USSR is hyperbole, not propaganda. Again, you refuse to acknowledge the satire of the thing. Do you believe that a satirical send-up of a political figure is a dangerous thing because some moron, who shall remain nameless, might not get the joke? Shall we ban Tom photoshopped image on the grounds that it's dangerous speech? Whew! Freedom, m'boy; Freedom! Keep yer eye on the prize. Posted by Tuning Spork at November 26, 2003 06:01 PM "So if it's fake why do you act like it's real?"
It's called "satire," Brian. Do you believe that SNL's Weekend Update is real? They sure act like it's real so it must be, right?
To get other people to believe it's real and put false, negative thoughts about Dean in people's heads? Yeah, that's called propoganda.
Calling a Socialist a Socialist is telling the truth. Comparing Dean to the USSR is hyperbole, not propaganda. Again, you refuse to acknowledge the satire of the thing. Do you believe that a satirical send-up of a political figure is a dangerous thing because some moron, who shall remain nameless, might not get the joke? Shall we ban Tom photoshopped image on the grounds that it's dangerous speech? Whew! Freedom, m'boy; Freedom! Keep yer eye on the prize. Posted by Tuning Spork at November 26, 2003 06:01 PM


Now. That was the first time i had ever been to this site before. it was linked from something on a different site. from what i read it seemed to be some sort of blog, speaking about whatever, etc. i saw no running theme of satire. with that said, comparing a text to SNL's Weekend Update is ridiculous. Weekend Update is just some people reporting some real news and then making a joke about it. There's no satire, its just jokes. they don't try to act like its a real news program...they laugh the whole time. there's plenty of evidence that it's comedy, and not satire, or even serious.
you wanna say satire, say something like The Onion. but even then the satire is so thick that its obvious. and its intelligent. calling a democratic presidential candidate a communist is neither satirical nor witty.
Calling a socialist a socialist is one thing. but when you say Socialist with a capital S that means something a bit different. Every president of the past 100 years has been a socialist in that they ran a country with social programs. However, they've all been either Democrat or Republican. Socialist, with the capital S, is a party, and a completely different school of thought than Dean tends to be, Democratic with socialist ideas.
And there was no comparing Dean to the USSR. There was however displaying Dean as a COMMUNIST, which is something entirely different than just a plain old socialist. There was no hyperbole, just plain namecalling. I don't remember any Marx spewing from Dean's mouth, i don't remember Dean wanting to do away with personal capital.

Finally, no i don't believe a photo is a dangerous thing. its not about that. and calling it a satirical send-up of a politician is quite a spin on what i like to call mudslinging.
I don't want any of this freedom crap, because i never said it should be banned. I said it was stupid, and it was misleading. It keeps republicans narrowminded about the other side because of something stupid. sure, most of them wouldn't think twice due to policy anyway, but if people could have an open mind it would be better. and that possibility is harder to obtain with the likes of such immature and unintelligent "satire."

Posted by Brian at December 2, 2003 02:09 AM

Thomas Jefferson, who was proud of being the "father" of the U. of Virginia, must be spinning in his grave to see that school give an object lesson in how to live in a dictatorship. This is not what he put himself on the line for during the American Revolution!

Posted by Bloodthirsty Warmonger at December 2, 2003 03:20 AM

I'll go you one better. In Washington DC a few years ago, a senior manager used the term 'niggardly' to describe new budget policy. He had to apologize and resign because ignorant employees were offended by a word they didn't know the meaning of.

Posted by Ted at December 2, 2003 10:36 AM

It's nothing more than a PC issue, which makes it ridiculous from the get-go. I don't have any scholarly references to back my opinion up on this. I just know that using political correctness as the bully stick to get people to behave the way a certain group thinks they should behave is ridiculous.
I have a particular loathing of the whole PC thing, it seems like repainting an outhouse in hopes no one will notice it still stinks.

Posted by LeeAnn at December 2, 2003 12:01 PM

Bloodthirsty Warmonger, As usual, you tell me something I didn't know (that T.J. had founded U.V.)! That to utter a word that has no specific definition other than being an offensive epithet could cause the speaker to be suspended from public duties would, I agreeably suspect, make Jefferson turn over, under, sideways & down in his grave.

Ted, Great call. I'd forgotten all about that "niggardly" brouhahah. Seems that some people can convince themselves that they're offended for reasons they can't even imagine.

LeeAnn, "It seems like repainting an outhouse in hopes no one will notice it still stinks."
That's the clearest analogy I've ever read!!

Brian; If your post has disappeared it's because I transferred to Tom's Nap Room. You can read read my response there if yer interested.

Simon; The word "Wogs" always reminds me of the Fawlty Towers episode where Basil is conversing with the Major:
MAJOR: Women... I knew one once!
FAWLTY: Oh?
MAJOR: Yes! I took her see India!
FAWLTY: India?
MAJOR: At the Oval! She enjoyed the film, but she kept referring to the Indians as "niggers!"
FAWLTY: Really?!
MAJOR: "No,no,no!" I said! "'Niggers' are the West Indians. These people are 'Wogs'!"
FAWLTY: Well...
MAJOR: Then she went to the Ladies Room to powder her nose or something or other... never came back!
FAWLTY: Oh dear.
MAJORS: She's still got my wallet...

Posted by Tuning Spork at December 2, 2003 11:18 PM

Fawlty Towers, along with Monty Python, are the peak of all British comedy. It's a shame there are so few episodes.

Don't mention the war...

BTW thanks for the nomination in the Wizbang poll.

Posted by Simon at December 3, 2003 12:54 AM

I don't know where you responded.

Posted by Brian at December 3, 2003 09:35 AM

In Sweden, they sell palm-size chocolate balls covered with coconut. These are called "Nigger Balls" and have zero negative conotations over here. Still, I cannot bring myself to call them that. I have been ball-less since moving here.

Posted by Helen at December 3, 2003 01:10 PM

Brian, I didn't, and your post is still here.
As I thought about a response I realized that we are about to go around in circles. But, what the hell:

"from what i read it seemed to be some sort of blog, speaking about whatever, etc. i saw no running theme of satire."

From what I gather: You saw Tom's post, assumed that he'd found it somewhere else on the web (since, as recall, he said he had), and that Tom actually believed it was legit. Since you didn't know Tom from Adam I suppose that's understandable.
But, it's still surprising that you'd assume that Tom actually believed that Dean was walking around with a hammer and sickle pin on his lapel. I think most people would've assumed that Tom knew the photo was a joke, and that he himself (since he didn't credit a source) was the one who created it.
"calling it a satirical send-up of a politician is quite a spin on what i like to call mudslinging.
I don't want any of this freedom crap, because i never said it should be banned. I said it was stupid, and it was misleading. It keeps republicans narrowminded about the other side because of something stupid. sure, most of them wouldn't think twice due to policy anyway, but if people could have an open mind it would be better. and that possibility is harder to obtain with the likes of such immature and unintelligent "satire.""

I really think you're over-reacting; it's not that serious. Regardless of whether or not the photo was funny or immature or brilliant or unintelligent, I doubt that crappy photo-shops are going to keep people narrow-minded about anything that people don't want to be narrow-minded about. The joke is funny (if it is) because it plays on an exaggerated view of a socialist. Whether or not Dean ever avowed allegience to the tenets of Karl Marx doesn't matter. It's just a way for people who want to restrain socialist trends to laugh at people who want to expand socialism.
"Mudslinging?" Nah! It's just a joke! An old SNL sketch that portrayed Reagan as a dundering senile old fool might have been funny (depending on how it was done). But anyone who saw it and "learned" that that was who Reagan was was either a dunce themselves, or grossly underinformed. Either way, if thy're getting their news from SNL or bad photo-shops, they're probably people who wouldn't care enough about the Truth to vote, anyway. I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Posted by Tuning Spork at December 3, 2003 07:18 PM

Well

Its just that when i see something like that i think of my dad. My dad is a die-hard republican. He's a republican in the sense that they're his team, they have to win, and the other team, consequently, must lose.

i think if my dad saw that pic, he would immediately save it, and email everyone on his huge email list that is exactly like him, and say "SEE! They ARE communist! If you don't like communists, and instead love america, please email this to 5000 people."

And he doesn't need that kind of ammo. it is learning who someone is, because they assume that he's a horrible person. so if they see that, that's all they need to prove it.

And there are many, many more people out there like that than i wish to imagine.

ps)i can't assume that he thought it was a joke, or assume that he made it, because there is nothing, not one shred of a reason to do so. no hint, no subtle nod. that's the same reason that pic of bush reading a kid's book upside down got around the internet.

pps) hrm, you must like SNL. its good stuff. and now that you mention it, i think weekend update is the best bit they've got with the current cast. :)

Posted by Brian at December 3, 2003 11:55 PM

Brian,
Yeah, Weekend Update seems to be the only thing worth catching lately.

If your political opinions are influenced by what you think of your Dad then you're either 19 or 29 years old. (I'm guessing yer closer to 19 ;P)

The biggest mistake we make when we're young is thinking that our elders are "too old to understand."
It's bullshit.

If you sat down with your father and really hashed things out you'll probably figure out that he's been You already and has passed it.

Posted by Tuning Spork at December 4, 2003 01:13 AM

While I must admit you are pretty damn close with the age guess I must say that my political opinions are not influenced by my father. Although now that I'm interested in politics, I have tried to discuss things with him. And its damn near impossible.

Yes, I know that it's a 99% chance that people won't believe me when I say its not the case that I think someone is "too old" to understand. but it's not a matter of age, but of opinion. open-minded conversations can be had by any mature persons of intelligence. i've never thought of anyone's age.

and, to tell you the truth, i have had conversations about these such things with my father. turns out he was never where i was and passed on. he's almost 56, and he has always been a republican, due to his father being so. no hippie movement, no drug induced days. he was never a hopeless optimist of a democrat.

anyway. i don't really know. but if this is it, it has been fun talking with you.

~~~later.

Posted by Brian at December 4, 2003 09:47 PM

Brian,
You're always welcome here, dude. Come by any time!

Posted by Tuning Spork at December 4, 2003 09:59 PM

Yeah, I know this is being posted almost two years too late, but "LandonTown" was better known as Mankato, MN.

I used to live there... the actual "Little House" was a few miles down the road (and crowded with Japanese tourists).

Posted by Wonderduck at May 28, 2005 01:07 PM
Post a comment









Remember personal info?